Wrongs

> God tells us in His word to be compassionate. He
> tells us to love on another as He loves us. God loves
> us all. He does not send us to Hell, we do. He gave
> us a free will to choose what we do with our
> lives.
>
> You know, if I arrive at the pearly gates and am
> asked if I want to come in or go to Hell, I'll take
> it into consideration. But if we truly decide for
> ourselves, then wouldn't we all make the "right"
> decision? After all, I have no idea that the bible is
> truly a god's word (even in the bible he says, or
> implies, there are others) therefore I am perfectly
> reasonaqble in saying that was truly ignorant of the
> truth and behaved as best I could under the
> circumstances (just ignore all the cookie boxes under
> my bed, please).
>
> Christ was the only perfect person to walk on this
> earth and look what they did to him.
>
>
> Have you ever read the book "Wicked"? It deals with
> another martyr. JFK was revered as a "savior" of
> sorts by my father's generation. Martin Luthor King
> was similarly murdered while trying to change our
> country for the better. Martyrs are common throughout
> history and they are ALWAYS associated with changing
> for the better. The gay community is oppressed in
> many ways and there are martyrs for us as well.
> Matthew Shepard for instance. He's dead you know.
> Killed by a pair of thugs who were heterosexual. Now
> I'm sure you'll say that's a different matter but it
> isn't. Penalizing gays for one thing only sets a
> precedent for more restrictions on their behavior and
> movements. Nazis did it, the inquisition did, and
> American Xtian movements are trying to do it now. You
> might disagree with concentration camps, but if you
> don't actively fight such movements within your own
> church then you are aiding them by your silent
> consent. Now it's only marriage and equality with
> heterosexuals your helping against but next could be
> registrations or taking away their own children (yes
> we can have them just as easily as heterosexuals can.
> Easier if we use the turkey baster but we can, and
> some still, do it the other way). The nazis managed
> to get to concentration camps in only a decade or so.
> Fortunately, we have the internet and that will make
> such a thing harder now, but it's not impossible.

THESE PEOPLE WERE NOT THE SON OF GOD.THEY WERE JUST MEN. THEY MAY BE MARTYRS BUT THEY WERE NOT PERFECT.

> Heavengoing, you really get on my nerves. You act
> like because you worked with black people and rode
> the bus with them that you are accepting of them.
> You act like because you can have a conversation
> n with a gay person (and you even have before) you
> are accepting of them. It's a bunch of crap. You
> are not accepting of them at at all. You tell us you
> have no hatred in your heart. But I have a one
> question? What if your own son proclaimed to be gay?
> What would you do?

TELL HIM I LOVE HIM AND TRY TALKING TO HIM. HE WOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO BRING HIS LOVER TO MY HOME. I WOULDN'T LET ONE OF MY DAUGHTERS SLEEP IN MY HOME WITH A MAN OUT OF MARRIAGE EITHER. MY HOME IS SMOKE FREE TO. NOT EVEN MY OWN CHILDREN THAT SMOKE SMOKES IN MY HOME. THEY KNOW THIS AND THEY ACCEPT THIS. MY FAMILY IS A VERY LOVING FAMILY AND I THANK GOD THAT I DO HAVE ANY THING LIKE THIS TO CONTENT WITH AMONG MY CHILDREN. JUST TO LET YOU KNOW I MEANT WHAT I SAID ABOUT NOT HATING ANYONE. I HAVE MIXED NIECES AND NEPHEWS IN MY FAMILY. THEIR FATHER IS BLACK AND THEIR MOTHER IS WHITE. I DON'T AGREE WITH THIS BUT I DON'T HOLD IT OVER HER HEAD BECAUSE SHE MARRIED A BLACK MAN. I LOVE THEM. ALL I AM DOING IS STATEING MY OPINION ON THIS BOARD. NO ONE CAN CHANGE HOW YOU BELIEVE OR HOW YOU LIVE EXCEPT GOD! BELIEVE ME WHEN I SAY HE IS REAL. ONE DAY YOU WILL KNOW THIS. I JUST SIMPLY SAY THAT GAY MARRIAGE IS WRONG. YOU KNOW, I STARTED TO WATCH A MOVIE THAT I HAVE NEVER SEEN LAST NIGHT AND ABOUT THE FOURTH OR FIFTH SCENE,THERE IT WAS TWO MEN KISSING LIKE A WOMAN AND A MAN. MADE ME SICK TO MY STOMACH AND I TURNED THE CHANNEL. IT IS NOT RIGHT FOR MAN TO SLEEP WITH MAN AND IT IS NOT RIGHT FOR WOMAN TO SLEEP WITH WOMAN. IT IS ALSO NOT RIGHT FOR MAN AND WOMAN TO SLEEP TOGETHER BEFORE MARRIAGE OR LIVE TOGETHER. MARRIAGE IS WHAT GOD CREATED AND WANTED. HE ALSO WANTED BOTH MALE AND FEMALE TO BE VIRGINS BEFORE MARRIAGE.

Understadable babyruth. Close minded people make me mad too, but, we need to try to realize that it is a fine line to walk, because if we are not careful - we could be lable close-minded, just at the opposite extreme. I do share your frustrations though.

Thank you for sharing your story, background, and struggle with us centexguy. You make so many valid points. I wholeheartily agree with your post and appreciate the content.

Oh - While I don't agree with pretty much anything that Heavengoing has said in any of the topics, that was a little harsh babyruth. It is not for us to judge him/her, just as it is not his/her place to judge us. Heavengoing has an opinion. As close-minded and maybe inacurate as it may be, it is not for us to judge his/her heart. I for one think that you are right about what you were taught about God and Love, but some people have been brainwashed for generations to believe that whatever the church teaches to be 100% the law, so we can't really blame him/her for not being able to form an opinion based on his/her own logic, and instead only be able to make references to the theology he/she was taught. I also feel sorry for Heavengoing, but even so, he she is entiled to his/her opinion, and respectfully, I welcome it, if for no other reason than to be able to take theological hypocracy and react to it with factual historical accounts and proof. But as far as sending him/her to hell... no my place to decided. I just hope that he/she has thought long and hard about it and is 100% sure that his/her convictions are true and not just what he/she was told to believe... because, ultimatley he/she will be held accountable for his/her words and actions, not the person(s) who taught it to him/her.

Um ... keep in mind, it is family members like heavensgoing that cause the suicide rate of young gay people to be so high. Who can they turn to when they realize they cannot turn to thier own family? So, to be honest, heavensgoing will never have a relative tell her they are gay, because her love is obviously conditional. She may say otherwise, but imagine being gay and in that family... just from all of her talk, it is quite evident, that being gay is not an option. We ask for her to imagine something that she never thinks could happen. I am sure that my grandmother thought the same thing, and the reason that I never told her that I was gay until she was literally on her death bed. Sad, I know - but just the way people who come from a family such as heavensgoing have to deal to survive.

Heavengoing, you really get on my nerves. You act like because you worked with black people and rode the bus with them that you are accepting of them. You act like because you can have a conversation with a gay person (and you even have before) you are accepting of them. It's a bunch of crap. You are not accepting of them at at all. You tell us you have no hatred in your heart. But I have a one question? What if your own son proclaimed to be gay? What would you do?

There's no reason to be anti-homosexual:

The story of Sodom and Gomorrah? That's a warning against rape and inhospitality. The reason for Sodom's destruction is made clear in Ezekiel 16:48-50. According to Ezekiel, the sins of Sodom were pride, laziness, being inhospitable, neglecting the needs of the poor, greed, and idolatry (the worshipping of idols). Nothing about homosexuality is mentioned.

Leviticus? Those passages were part of the Holiness Code which has been done away with and is no longer binding to modern-day Christians.

1 Corinthians? Mistranslation - the word malakee in this passage is used elsewhere in the Bible to mean someone who lacks discipline or one who is morally weak, and never is it used in reference to sexuality or gender.

1 Timothy? Also a mistranslation. 1 Timothy was an admonishment against male prostitution, not committed, loving same sex relationships.

Romans? In the passage the Greek words physin and paraphysin have been translated to mean natural and unnatural respectively. Contrary to popular belief, the word paraphysin does not mean "to go against the laws of nature", but rather implies action which is uncharacteristic for that particular person. An example of the word paraphysin is used in Romans 11:24, where God acts in an uncharacteristic (paraphysin) way to accept the Gentiles. When the scripture is understood correctly, it seems to imply that it would be unnatural for a homosexual to live as a heterosexual and vice versa.